Community RPG Codex GOTY 2015 Poll - All citizens take part

[Lurker King]

I'm showing the audience everything there is, so they might decide for themselves what they prefer; while you are asking for someone to arbitrary decide what people want and only allow them to vote for those.

If you did a poll for best rock band of the year, would you include every single album released that year? Of course, not. A cousin of mine published an album, with 10 copies. He wants to participate in the world poll. Please, include him so that people can have a choice. It’s obvious you wouldn’t do that. That poll would suck. How about the Nobel Prize? Do you think that every physics and biology paper released in the same year would be proper candidates? Look, say whatever you want, but at the end of the day, some players will be induced by this poll, because they think that this is a normal poll, where there is some pedigree and merit in the selection. They don’t think that this is a list of every game released, but a list of every game that players deemed worthy to be included. Who knows, maybe you are including these games precisely because of that. If you want people to be aware of every game released this year, just make a survey each year with one paragraph of description for each game. The list would still have a harmful influence, but at least people would not have to swallow an inclusion of a bunch of idiotic games in a poll about the best cRPG of the year. Everybody wins.

Lightning Returns is doing badly at the poll, clearly the Codex didn't enjoy it. I knew it would come to this, but I always thought best to let the people decide that by themselves - you know, offer choice.

Which just shows that it shouldn’t be in the list in the first place. If you audience don’t care about a game, don’t include in the best game of the year poll. Of course, this is just a detail. You got what you wanted. You promoted a jRPG down your audience throat in the middle of a poll, whether they liked or not.

However, it seems some narrow minded idiots think they know for sure which the best games are - or that someone should decide for him - and rather live in safe spaces where no opposing view might ever reach them - WHAT IF A JRPG HAD A GOOD SCORE? WHAT WOULD I DO?

That is rich. Now, every time someone argues that we shouldn’t promote garbage, he is a closed minded type who can’t take criticism. Why don’t you include Super Mario in the list? Many people think that every type of game are cRPGs. You wouldn’t want to discard their point of view, would you? Of course you do. Don’t try to change the subject if the “you are closed mind” card. You are pretending that you are being the most neutral possible, when in reality is precisely the opposite. You are taking every opportunity you can to promote the games that you want, even if they have nothing do with your audience. If you were honest to take the criticism, none of these games would be included in the first place. You are making a poll for a community of players that hate the type of games you are including. You are doing that anyway, because for you imposing promoting diversity among cRPG players is more important than that. The purpose of a poll is neither being inclusive nor promoting obscure games, but to select worthy candidates that are deemed the best for a given community.

 

[throwaway]

Why the duck is the list littered with Final Fantasy dross? I didn't escape the watch to get swamped by weeaboo aberration on the codex.

 

[Darth Roxor]

lurker king is right we should just leave 5 options in the poll

aod
AoD
Age of Decadence
The Age of Decadence
Irontower Studio's The Age of Decadence

that would certainly please him

 

[felipepepe]

Which just shows that it shouldn’t be in the list in the first place. If you audience don’t care about a game, don’t include in the best game of the year poll. Of course, this is just a detail. You got what you wanted. You promoted a jRPG down your audience throat in the middle of a poll, whether they liked or not.

How the fuck am I promoting a game by having the entire Codex blast it with negative votes? "Hey guys, Lightning Returns is second last in our poll, right next to Dungeon Lords! I hope everyone will play it now!"

Get a grip man. Or go to the police and show where the evil JRPG touched you.

 

[Aenra]

felipepepe i don't know if this is your doing, but why make it anonymous? Why make it so that the same person can vote a hundred times if they so pleased? You smeared shit all over this 'contest' before it even begun..
What's the point?
(unless i'm missing something?)

 

[felipepepe]

I did the best with the tools & time I had / was willing to spend. Google polls delivers everything to me in a clean excel sheet, I just have to paste my formulas from last year. In 2013 I tried making a vote via thread, but it's a pain to collect all the data and there are trolls fucking shit up regardless. Just look at toro's alternative poll. He won't admit it, but he'll likely have to input the data of +100 votes by hand, because people aren't following his guidelines.

Besides, the retard who made a shitty and easily-detectable script aside, I think my poll is going very well. The results have been consistent since the start and represent what you see going around the forums.

 

[Xzylvador]

Consider it as an experiment; a month from now we'll compare the result to the one from toro's poll and see how many votes were botted/spammed.

 

[an Administrator]

It could be better if poll allows voters to vote ONLY ONE TIME.

 

[Xzylvador]

Impossible to do without linking to forum account (and even then there's alts).

 

[an Administrator]

No one has about 50 alts but it is pretty easy now to vote 50 times for a game like Undertale

 

[Lucky]

This is a poll. A popularity contest that attempts to answer what the most popular game on the Codex of 2015 was. You cannot answer "what is the best game of 2015" with it because no distinction can be made between the arguments the different voters have to support their votes. That’s what discussion is for on an internet forum like this, because you’re not going to get any agreement on ways to assign value to people’s arguments either, nor would that likely even be doable.

Attempting to answer the latter question by preselection under these circumstances will only result in people deluding themselves into thinking that such a poll would have any value whatsoever. The first question you can at least attempt to answer and in order to do so you’ll want to take into account the extremes on both ends of the spectrum of the poll to give perspective – the least favourite, the most favourite, the favourite liked the least, etc – so adding many different games to vote on makes sense, as you’re otherwise diluting your data sample for no good reason. That’s about as good as you’re going to get here and asking for more would involve genuine research and all the work that comes with that.

 

[V_K]

A simple check against multiple votes could be done like this, for example:
1) Make a forum post detailing your vote.
2) Fill a Google poll.
3) Attach to the poll a link to your post.
It wouldn't stop anyone from voting multiple times, but it would make it fairly easy to check suspicious votes (alts notwithstanding).

 

[Kz3r0]

No one has about 50 alts

 

[Septaryeth]

I don't get why all the debate over a poll, and why do people have such a high expectation for it.
First it should be limited to certain prestigious games only and now we are worrying about bots?

It's an internet poll that has to be reminded of its existence by opening another thread in the news section ffs.
If people really have the energy and will to troll with an innocent poll they will find a way regardless of what you do.
What do they get out of it? It's not like the codex is going to invite the developers and host a videogame award ceremony. But who cares, the rest of us can have a laugh and get over it, and maybe throw another one.

Seriously though, I enjoy watching butthurt over videogames like every other good codexers but such unnecessary drama over a freaking poll is just silly.

 

[Bubbles]

What do they get out of it? It's not like the codex is going to invite the developers and host a videogame award ceremony.

Now you've spoiled the surprise.

 

[Zorba the Hutt]

I'd be more worried if there wasn't drama over the GOTY poll.

 

[Cowboy Moment]

This Lurker King stupidity makes me reflect on just how effective the Codex' image of an elite club for gentlemen of refined taste must be, for all these 2015 newfags to buy into it so completely. "How can it be that such a prestigious magazine's GOTY poll includes filthy plebeian JRPGs?! Surely it must be a degenerate weaboo conspiracy!". Must be really hard to accept that their newly acquired membership is not, in fact, a mark of intelligence and good taste.

Lurker King remember the Top70 CRPG poll that we did some time ago? The one that was heavily promoted, whose results were eventually tarted up with screenshots and mini-reviews and stickied on the front page (and are still stickied on top of "official" FB and Twitter feeds), and which got a surprising amount of attention on more mainstream fora such as Reddit or NeoGAF? You could literally vote for any game you wanted on that one, it didn't need to be an RPG even by the most lax of criteria. Chew on that fact for a bit before you continue whining about a relatively inconsequential GOTY poll.

 

[felipepepe]

A popularity contest that attempts to answer what the most popular game on the Codex of 2015 was.

Nope. I use the rating system & bayesian average exactly to avoid the poll becoming a popularity contest.

Let me give you an example:

The first graph is from a game that has tons of votes, but you can clearly see people rate it "meh-to-good", with the majority giving it 3, then 4. The second has less than 1/3 of those votes, but people mostly rated it "good-to-great", so clearly it's a better game, even though the other one is way more popular.

 

[Lurker King]

This is a poll. A popularity contest that attempts to answer what the most popular game on the Codex of 2015 was.

Exactly, and is precisely because of that they shouldn’t be used to promote obscure candidates or ideological attempts to change the audience view about the eligible candidates. POLLS ABOUT WHO IS THE FAVORITE ARE POPULARITY CONTESTS.

 

[Lurker King]

lurker king is right we should just leave 5 options in the poll

aod
AoD
Age of Decadence
The Age of Decadence
Irontower Studio's The Age of Decadence

that would certainly please him

Nope, I just think that the poll should reflect the perception of Codex members. I despise TW3, but a lot of people here enjoy the game. Therefore, it makes sense that it should be included in the pool. However, that ungodly amount of games that nobody heard about, or jRPGs that six people enjoy, shouldn’t be on the list.

 

[Darth Roxor]

if nobody heard about those games or only 6 people enjoy them then what practical damage does their inclusion bring to this voting at large

 

[Azael]

This poll made me realize just how few games I played last year, yet I still had (very little) time for League of Legends. Fucking addictions mang, how do they work?



Anyway, voted for Age of Decadence for numero uno and Underrail as second.

 

[Mozg]

I played shit all year and still played like 10% of the games available

Fuck you mid-2000s

 

[Lucky]

Nope. I use the rating system & bayesian average exactly to avoid the poll becoming a popularity contest.

Let me give you an example:

The first graph is from a game that has tons of votes, but you can clearly see people rate it "meh-to-good", with the majority giving it 3, then 4. The second has less than 1/3 of those votes, but people mostly rated it "good-to-great", so clearly it's a better game, even though the other one is way more popular.

I know. I was using popular in the sense of using a numerical value based on votes to judge a claim, so here both the number of votes and the percentages of the ratings are a measure of the games' popularity.
To take your example, the first game was played by more but rated lower, while the second game was played by less but rated higher. For the purpose of the poll, the second game will hold a higher position and in that sense be the more popular/regarded game because the rating percentage is given precedence to a degree - we don't only want to know what game people played the most, but also how much they liked the games that they played.
However, whether it is a better game or not is a separate matter because the numerical value does not reflect the quality of the game but its reception and spread. What you'll learn from it is what a majority, in percentage and votes, considers to be the best game at this point in time. In other words, the most popular game. Even if the ratings were reversed, the game with less votes wouldn't necessarily be worse than the one with more, but instead show that the game was received as being worse. That's not to say that quality cannot be a factor in a game's popularity, but you won't be able to determine said quality by relying on measuring the game's popularity, so you will be unable to answer the question "what is the best game".

Exactly, and is precisely because of that they shouldn’t be used to promote obscure candidates or ideological attempts to change the audience view about the eligible candidates. POLLS ABOUT WHO IS THE FAVORITE ARE POPULARITY CONTESTS.

The difficulty is that you cannot know for certain ahead of time what games will and won't be obscure or popular in a meaningful way. There needs to be room for exceptions, otherwise you’re doing nothing but affirming what everyone already knows.

 

[Xzylvador]

Nope, I just think that the poll should reflect the perception of Codex members. I despise TW3, but a lot of people here enjoy the game. Therefore, it makes sense that it should be included in the pool. However, that ungodly amount of games that nobody heard about, or jRPGs that six people enjoy, shouldn’t be on the list.

Yes, but then don't you see that pre-selecting games won't work? Who's going to do this selection?
If left to you (and another x people with similar tastes), odds are TW3 (or any other game you don't personally like) wouldn't be on the list everyone gets to choose from.
The only way to assemble a decent and complete list not colored by bias, prejudice or preference then would be to... make a poll and let people select from all games.
And then from that poll draw a list of the 25 most popular ones and let everyone vote again.
...
Why not just skip that second part and just extrapolate results directly from the first poll?